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1900S valve rockers

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hi everyone,

Busy doing a restoration on a Manta A. You can click here if you wanna see progress

I removed the rocker cover to get it cleaned up and found rust on the rockers and some bolts that hold those in place, so I removed them all. I'm ready to reinstall those but I just wanted to know if there are certain torque settings I need to use when putting them back? Any special procedures?

All helpful comments are welcomed.

cheers,

Derik

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The nuts in the centre of the rockers are the clearance adjustment.  If they are tightened down you'll have no valve clearances.. They are an inference fit on th studs so shouldn't ever work loose - but need adjustment ocassionally to take up any wear.

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Those rocker nuts in your pic don't look standard, they should look like this.

and do you have the rocker studs out as well?

If the head is very gunked up make sure you get it washed as the rocker studs have a small hole to feed the oil through and they can get bunged up. Do you have an engine shop that can wash it for you? 

You can see all the standard bits here

https://www.opelgtsource.com/store/gt/engine/1.9-valve.html

 

060720121718.jpg

6029.jpg

I can also scan the A series workshop Manuel section if you want? that will have all the info for the head, and the build up procedure if you need it?

Im just rebuilding my head and the engine place said it was so mucky and blocked up where the oil had not been changed for so long they took all the studs out as well and cleaned the whole block out properly.

Andy

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9 hours ago, 611 said:

Those rocker nuts in your pic don't look standard, they should look like this.

and do you have the rocker studs out as well?

If the head is very gunked up make sure you get it washed as the rocker studs have a small hole to feed the oil through and they can get bunged up. Do you have an engine shop that can wash it for you? 

You can see all the standard bits here

https://www.opelgtsource.com/store/gt/engine/1.9-valve.html

 

060720121718.jpg

6029.jpg

I can also scan the A series workshop Manuel section if you want? that will have all the info for the head, and the build up procedure if you need it?

Im just rebuilding my head and the engine place said it was so mucky and blocked up where the oil had not been changed for so long they took all the studs out as well and cleaned the whole block out properly.

Andy

Hi Andy thanks for the reply! The car has those nuts with normal nuts on top of them. I'll take pics of everything tomorrow to show you. Please scan the workshop manual as mentioned - that would be greatly appreciated! I haven't removed the studs but the car has been standing for a very long time so the holes in the studs as you mentioned are probably blocked...will have to check that out to avoid 

 

10 hours ago, malbasys said:

The nuts in the centre of the rockers are the clearance adjustment.  If they are tightened down you'll have no valve clearances.. They are an inference fit on th studs so shouldn't ever work loose - but need adjustment ocassionally to take up any wear.

Alright cool. Thanks for the info!

 

10 hours ago, Mickfrad said:

Hi Derik, you may find this article useful 

http://www.opelclub.com/TuneUpPart1aJune2006.pdf

Excellent! Will have a look at that now.

 

Appreciate all the replies gents!

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I will sort out the section from the manual tonight and drop you a link.

Its strange that those nuts are on top of the others ones, sounds like they have put them on to stop them coming lose. The rocker nuts should not easily come lose as they are not like normal nuts. Have you taken the nuts off yet? if you have did the studs move? If you are in no rush it might be worth taking all the studs and nuts out to see where you are. You can get new nuts and studs from Opel GT Source in the US and they are not that expensive. The workshop manual goes through a full strip down and im sure it includes taking out the studs. I have all new ones going in mine as i never did a full clean of the head and the holes were blocked and didnt do the cam bearing much good, hence the full strip down and rebuild!!

Andy

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On 17/12/2018 at 10:34, 611 said:

I will sort out the section from the manual tonight and drop you a link.

Its strange that those nuts are on top of the others ones, sounds like they have put them on to stop them coming lose. The rocker nuts should not easily come lose as they are not like normal nuts. Have you taken the nuts off yet? if you have did the studs move? If you are in no rush it might be worth taking all the studs and nuts out to see where you are. You can get new nuts and studs from Opel GT Source in the US and they are not that expensive. The workshop manual goes through a full strip down and im sure it includes taking out the studs. I have all new ones going in mine as i never did a full clean of the head and the holes were blocked and didnt do the cam bearing much good, hence the full strip down and rebuild!!

Andy

Hi Andy,

thanks for all your help thus far.

I don't know if the studs shifted when I took them out. I'll check the link that you posted. Just a question (I'll also reference the rebuild link you sent me) - should the holes in the studs be aligned in a certain way? I've attached photos of them all as taken from the spark plug side of the engine to show holes where the lifters (should - they've been removed) sit.

Cylinder 1:

20181218_115909_zpsowxm8b8l.jpg

Cylinder 2:

20181218_115919_zpsq4cozqbw.jpg

Cylinder 3:

20181218_115924_zpsh8cg7vq0.jpg

Cylinder 4:

20181218_115928_zpszygnhae9.jpg

I know I probably wouldn't be able to tell if the holes in the studs are blocked or not but they seem to be open. There's no dirt or rust in any one of them from what I could see

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Can you blow the stud holes through with an airline?

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Hey Derik

They dont look like they have moved, it seems to be more of an issue on the 2.4 head. If they had moved you would never be able to get the nut off without taking the whole stud out as once the stud moves you cant get those nuts off being a friction fit.

I dont think it makes any difference to where the hole sits as the rocker pivot (sort of ball type bit) has two groves in it to allow the oil out and it should flow out into the rocker when running. I think its more the fact that the inside of the stud can get blocked and not allow the oil out of that little oil hole (see pics of stud i have out) I suppose its just a case of seeing if you can get some cleaner through there and coming out the oil hole to make sure its clear. Im not a 100% sure of the exact setup as not had a careful look at mine. Its just my engine guy called me to say mine were bunged up and he thought that the oil would have been quite restricted and could have caused the problems with oil flow. The oil way diagram shows it in more detail. (page 11 on my link)

Im not sure if anyone else on here has any thoughts?

 

Andy

IMG_20181218_2013319.jpg

IMG_20181218_2013047.jpg

IMG_20181218_2012558.jpg

6 minutes ago, IanMc said:

Can you blow the stud holes through with an airline?

Maybe run some thinner through and then try the airline?

It seems the set of studs i have from Opel GT Source have bigger holes in as well. The original 2.4 holes are quite small.

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Hi. The studs oil hole can be any orientation. It depends on where it ends up when the actual stud is put in and tightened.there does look to be a bit of wear on cylinder 3 right hand stud .the threads near the top  seem a bit worn so that may be why someone put extra locknuts on. 

To do a bolt and braces job you would replace all studs and buts but if it were me personally I would just try them first. The nuts go a fair way down so may well go past the worn bit anyway and it’s probably just the actual crimped/ squashed top thread of the nut that has made the wear anyway.

i would assemble the head and adjust each rocker cold to the 12 thou clearance and notice if any nuts were realy easy to tighten. Any that were I would just remove,tap on the top of the nut with a hammer to tighten the thread locking part and refit.  That’s all they are when new anyway ,just a squashed top thread or two to act as a self locking nut. If you can get new nuts that’s fine but they may also be a little slack if it’s the actual stud part that’s worn.

the idea is to have a nut that won’t vibrate loose and any that arnt doesnt affect or damage the engine but means you will need to adjust them more often 

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Thanks for all the replies guys! The nuts came off fairly easily when I removed them. They were a little tight because when they were removed they were all dried up and, like I showed in the build thread, the top nuts that were there for whatever reason, were rusted. I'll refit them today and do the clearances and see what happens from there

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The nuts should be quite tight when they go on, if they go on nice and easy they will work lose, so will need adjusting as cam.in.head said above.

You might find that is why the top nut was on to lock them in place. If you can adjust the nuts you can get new quite easy now.

Opel GT Source and i think www.edelschmiede.com have them.

 

Andy

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hi everyone,

been really busy...going to update the build thread now.

As mentioned above - some nuts went on quite easily and others didn't, so I suspect the locking part is worn which is why the extra nuts were inserted. I haven't really given much attention to the engine as I've been real busy sorting out the bodywork...

Thanks for all the help! I'll update this thread again as soon as I start working on the rockers again🤗

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Let me know if you need any bits as my head has now come back from the engine shop after having new cam bearings fitted and and i will be stripping it down and fitting all new rockers, nuts, studs etc.. only because i manage to find a complete new set many years ago and as im fitting a new cam i thought i would do the whole lots while im there. The ones one there are all good, so let me know if you need any bits.

 

Andy

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As cam.in.head mentioned above the nuts are easy to repair to self-locking, I put the top in a vise and put some tension on it.

The top will be a bit oval and locks again.

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