19 replies to this topic

[stoo2000]

Please make sure you read our recent Announcement.

[Shuviteer]

BET THIS IS A BIT OF A DEATH KNELL !!
Limiting things even more than before, but even more importantly, changing the format, will lead to a reduced  viewing.
Is the 'new' viewing figures as opossed to the 'old' going to be posted up for all to see ??
Although I'm no longer a member, I came on here EVERY day, and noticed that not eveyone (most really !!) were not members of any description, does that mean they will not be able to participate !!????
Good ideas on paper do not always mean good practice in the real working world.
Personally I think whoever has decided this has shot themselves, and the club, in the foot !

[manta400john]

Shuviteer, on 21 November 2011 - 02:17 AM, said:

Although I'm no longer a member, I came on here EVERY day,

Sounds like the decision has been made to get more folks to join the club, this surely isn't a bad thing. The savings that can be made from the trade club can MORE than cover the membership fee and now you see the for sale section first with other members.
Although I don't have my Manta on the road just now, I still paid my money to support the club in a small way. I come on here most days too  .....  a bit like you?
John.

[stoo2000]

Shuviteer, on 21 November 2011 - 02:17 AM, said:

BET THIS IS A BIT OF A DEATH KNELL !!
Limiting things even more than before, but even more importantly, changing the format, will lead to a reduced  viewing.
Is the 'new' viewing figures as opossed to the 'old' going to be posted up for all to see ??
Although I'm no longer a member, I came on here EVERY day, and noticed that not eveyone (most really !!) were not members of any description, does that mean they will not be able to participate !!????
Good ideas on paper do not always mean good practice in the real working world.
Personally I think whoever has decided this has shot themselves, and the club, in the foot !

It isn't, I agree it's a different approach than most forums out there take (limiting people posting ads), we've talked about this alot at Exec meetings, if you limit people being able to sell stuff, they go elsewhere. We're not limiting the ability for anyone to sell anything by any means. We've had numerous complaints in the past that someone has signed up and bought a rare, or much needed item before anyone else had chance and then they dissapeared, never to contribute anything to the club.

By making new For Sale items restricted to OMOC Members & Web Members, we are adding value to our Membership Packages.

The Exec Committee as a whole decided to make this change going forward.

Traffic statistics are monitored closely, we've been in positive climb since our transistion to IP.Board.

[paulmanta]

Shuviteer, on 21 November 2011 - 02:17 AM, said:

BET THIS IS A BIT OF A DEATH KNELL !!
Limiting things even more than before, but even more importantly, changing the format, will lead to a reduced  viewing.
Is the 'new' viewing figures as opossed to the 'old' going to be posted up for all to see ??
Although I'm no longer a member, I came on here EVERY day, and noticed that not eveyone (most really !!) were not members of any description, does that mean they will not be able to participate !!????
Good ideas on paper do not always mean good practice in the real working world.
Personally I think whoever has decided this has shot themselves, and the club, in the foot !

Ironically, as a non member you have little or no say in any of the decisions taken regarding the club and forum.

The club pays for the forum via the subs from members and a small google-ads type revenue. Getting more people to pay up is good for the club, having a lot of people like you using the forum for free "every day" is not great for the club,  encoraging people to dip their toes in the forum short term before they join up (try before you buy) is good for the club though as it drums up new members.

Adverts should always be free, too many non members might want to buy or sell parts/a car and the club would lose out if the adverts were fully restricted.

Creating a members "first dibs" system is a nice Idea but could be a problem for those with deals to do but no intention of ever joining up.

Edited by paulmanta, 21 November 2011 - 10:37 AM.

[dog321fish]

I agree as a non member I have no say in the decisions taken regarding the club.

Can you please explain the benefit to the seller of restricting his items for sale to a wider audience for 7 days?

How about a reduced membership charge for the unemployed and retired thus possibly increasing membership & revenue this way?

Best regards

Dave

[fabmanta]

I would firstly like to point out that the executive committee and decisions made by the same are done in the best interests of the club and the members of the club.  The exec committee do not make decisions plucked out of the air, but in response to paying member’s feedback, as if we have no members, we do not have a club.

As has already been mentioned, the open section of the club forum is designed as a ‘dip your toe in’ area, where non-members can see what the club is like and ultimately encouraging them to join and support the club through paid membership.  If non-members or members whose membership has lapsed continue to use this area, for example if they are unable to afford their membership in these difficult financial times, then this is an area, where they can continue to stay in touch with the club and its members, but as many members ask ‘why should they have the benefits of paid up members of the club?’  Which is a valid point and the executive committee have a responsibility to represent their members and act accordingly.

FOR SALE adverts can still be placed freely by non-members, but the idea of being a paid up member of the club, is that there are benefits that come with this.  Thus all paying club members have ‘first dibs’ on any FOR SALE items, before those whom are not members.  With regards to the benefit for the seller, of having their adverts restricted for 7 days;

1.   They are able to advertise on the OMOC UK forum free of charge.
2.   The audience for the first 7 days is around 300 members currently, so if the part / car they are advertising is rare / sought after / needed by a member, it will be snapped up by a club member and the seller will benefit financially as they would selling to any non-member.

With regards to a reduced membership charge for those unemployed or retired.  In theory this would be a great idea, but the exec have already looked at this in these days of financial difficulty and unfortunately this is not financially viable for the club.  Full club membership £25, pays for quarterly club magazines and free / reduced entry to some shows, in some local area memberships, as well as supporting the website and forum.  Web / forum membership contributes to the running and updating of the website / forum.  However for those who are unable to afford full membership, web / forum membership is only £15 per annum and gives full access to all forum areas / benefits, thus this may be something to consider if full membership is not viable for individuals currently.

In order to continue as a club, we need to move forward in a positive way and demonstrate to our members that they are valued and have a voice, which will continue to be represented by their elected executive committee.

With regards to ‘viewing figures’, these will be reported upon at the next club AGM in April 2012, where all club members are welcome to attend or send their thoughts / ideas and to also participate in the postal ballot regarding any changes made to the way the club functions / important decisions being made.

Regards,

Fiona Middleton.

[andyc]

I for one would just like to say well done but i think we need to do more. Having just done a count up in BasicTech on the first page there are a total of 28 posts with 19 of them being from non members and where i think the big problem is is in parts wanted, again you have 28 posts on the first page and 18 are from non members, some with hundreds of posts to there name. Are these people going to join??????

I know if i have anything that i want to sell it will go to a paid up member first and more importantly cheaper than to a non member. I think we need to limit these two sections as well.

Like it says on the front page Opel Mantas Owners Club, this is a forum for Members of the Opel Mantas Owners Club. By all means visit the club webb site, which could do with an over haul , but from there on in if you have a Manta and want access to club parts, knowledge etc then part with some cash like the rest of have done.

You can soon save the money you have paided out by using the Clubs trade club card even if you owen a different make and model you can still save on oils etc plus insurance discounts as well

Ok that should start a few rattles flying.....................

Cheers
Andy

[simon p]

andyc, on 21 November 2011 - 09:47 PM, said:

I for one would just like to say well done but i think we need to do more. Having just done a count up in BasicTech on the first page there are a total of 28 posts with 19 of them being from non members and where i think the big problem is is in parts wanted, again you have 28 posts on the first page and 18 are from non members, some with hundreds of posts to there name. Are these people going to join??????

I know if i have anything that i want to sell it will go to a paid up member first and more importantly cheaper than to a non member. I think we need to limit these two sections as well.

Like it says on the front page Opel Mantas Owners Club, this is a forum for Members of the Opel Mantas Owners Club. By all means visit the club webb site, which could do with an over haul , but from there on in if you have a Manta and want access to club parts, knowledge etc then part with some cash like the rest of have done.

You can soon save the money you have paided out by using the Clubs trade club card even if you owen a different make and model you can still save on oils etc plus insurance discounts as well

Ok that should start a few rattles flying.....................

Cheers
Andy

Indeed, during many chats at the NEC this year,  it was suggested that the whole site should be members only.

[andyc]

couldn't agree more. Oh give us a shout about the gearbox

Andy

[smiffy220]

I am not currently a paid up member, I was last year and will be next year, but had a difficult year financially this year and just couldn't warrant an extra £25 to the family for club membership when I couldn't afford to tax the car either this year. However, I can understand the clubs decision on this and would support the stance taken. I think it's a good idea, and just hope some of the non-members sign up and keep this great club going.
With regard to restricting the forum completely, I don't think that is a good idea as I think I said before. Case in point, I used to rally Talbot Sunbeams and have a garage full of spares for the Sunbeam/Avenger. I tried to get onto the Avenger Sunbeam Owners Club website to sell some of these parts, but you have to pay £25 membership fee to advertise and use the forum. If those members wanted to buy the parts, they can't as I'm not paying £25 to sell parts for a car I no longer own. So they go on evil bay. Therefore those members miss out on first dibs.
Keep the open section of the forum for non-members, but encourage membership as much as possible, I think a 7 day wait period for non-members if a good thing.
Good luck with the future of the club, I'll be rejoining in the new year.
Dave

[Alf]

For what it's worth, I'm a new Member and your system worked perfectly for me, I came, had a look, waited a while, then joined, it was great and I thought a really good way of letting potential new members see what they're letting themselves in for!

As for making it a 'Members Only' Forum, I'm not too sure?  If the Statistics that Andy quotes above me are correct, it would make things very much quieter on here, were that to happen, maybe a lot of Members would lose interest and post less? Then it's a downward spiral from there, I have seen this happen on another site I frequent, eventually it's so quiet nobody bothers to have a look anymore, it's all about striking a balance and from what I can see, I think those responsible are doing a very good job, I like things the way they are!!

Cheers,
Alf.

Edited by Alf, 22 November 2011 - 10:03 AM.

[Kevin Bricknall]

I'm a paid up member but I cant access links in the For Sale Section that are for members only.  Also I cant find a number of sections of the forum which I could last week.

And it looks like I am now a user and and have only one post to my name.  That's not correct as I have posted many things over the year.

Could some one investigate.

Edited by Kevin Bricknall, 28 November 2011 - 10:10 AM.

[KevinBricknall]

I appear to have sorted it.  For what ever reason the above ID is my Facebook ID.  Not sure how that has come about but all seems ok now.

[stoo2000]

KevinBricknall, on 28 November 2011 - 10:11 AM, said:

I appear to have sorted it.  For what ever reason the above ID is my Facebook ID.  Not sure how that has come about but all seems ok now.

Hi Kevin,

It looks like you have logged in with Facebook, which creates a new account if you haven't previously associated your forum account with your facebook account. You can associate them here: http://forums.mantac...e&area=facebook

Stuart

[rutts]

best thing that has happened in a long time, keep the items for sale for paid up members only for 7 days is just what we needed.

[opel2000]

What superb decision,
Many OMOC members have been members for many years (I first joined in 1992 nearly 20 years ago) and members feel they need to get a little something for their membership fee and in these days of much needed parts being thin on the ground, then giving members first shout to obtain them is spot on.

I really can't see why anyone should complain about this at all, possibly one of the best deciscions the exec has made towards the Forum yet.

Whole forum members only.............. Whoah big strong disagree with that.   Having hit some bad times over the last 3 years money has been quite scarce at times and was unable to renew my membership, making the forum members only would remove me from the forum of a club that I have possibly put more into over the years than someone that pays for a membership just for a couple of years, but yet he/she could have access to advice given by myself and others that the suppliers of said advice would not be able to access. But then again that is pretty much there anyway with the members only section. Which I've always strongly disagreed with due to the statement above.

Edited by opel2000, 28 November 2011 - 06:29 PM.

[d818anr]

Remembering some of the grief years ago when certain non members made this forum like a warzone (Clive, do you remember that person who ended up getting their IP address banned?), having some sort of members only area to access is not too bad a thing, but don't shut the whole site away. in this day and age a forum is probably the best way to advertise a club like this. it was dabbling in the forum again after chatting to people on Facebook that got me joined up again, if the forum had been shut away I dont know if my rejoining would have happened to be honest.

[Shuviteer]

Example (my case only !) , if site was closed ,folk would be less inclined to join just to have a look. I also have a lerge interest in Lancia's, but only go on two sites as they are fully open to folk wanting info! The other site that rquires PAID membership is avoided by myself.
Lots of others don't visit said site either for the same reason.
So, restricting access will definately stop folk from coming on the site .
Certain things did need changing, and with a bit of after thought, then perhaps the bit about waiting 7 days before folk can see the for sale threads could be good.However, if a non member wants to post up bits for sale (for ALL to see), so that the community can benifit, then surely THAT should be a good thing for everyone !!
Think about it........ instead of an OPEN SITE that everyone can participate in, you end up with folk selling on fleabay first !

Perhaps you might all like to look on the 406.com site to see how a TOTALLY FREE site manages to operate ! That site has alot more activity than this, but things are relative I suppose. Just that paying for things doesn't always make them best. !!!

[d818anr]

but can you understand that those that are paying their £25 might be concerned that someone else not paying gets access to all the adverts etc, and a lot of the benefits of the club for nothing. They then take the decision not to pay, as does every other member and bang, the manta club is gone.
As I have said members only & non members only areas are my preferred way, and I like this delayed release of ads to non members. lets remember that these parts are being listed most of the time because someone wants some cash, not to 'support' the scene. Chances are they try their luck on here before going to EBay, who do charge. If they have an issue with not being allowed to list to non members straight away then thats up to them, but as it is a club site paid for by the members, and there is no charge for adverts, then I dont see there is any arguement in regards to the club choosing to hold those adverts from non members for a week.

I'm sure there are many people on here who remember when you paid to advertise in the Club, and at a higher rate for non members if memory serves me right!