50 replies to this topic

[Manta again]

Ok the car is a 1.8 OHC. The problem first occured at Billing the car was left standing for 3 days in the sun when we came to start her she wouldn't start until we poured some fuel down the carb and eventually she fired up. This continued on and off for a couple of months but just always assumed it was due to syphoning back. Then a new problem occured if you accelerate hard after 5-8 secs the car splutters as if she has ran out of fuel. Also last week she failed to start after a short trip and could only be started with fuel down the carb. A month ago i fitted a new fuel pump in an effort to resolve some of the issues, no change. At the weekend I changed the New varijet carb for a weber no change!!!!!!! the wife now wants shot of the car as its not really a daily driver when it wont F******g start. HELP cheers.

Edited by Manta again, 02 November 2011 - 07:02 PM.

[mantapaperman]

hi there. if it never fails to start with fuel down carb and youve changed pump then it most certainly will be crap in the tank/ fuel lines or fuel filter. really need to clean tank out or replace and blow fuel line out..also if you change or put a filter near carb you will see if it is mucky or starving fuel. hope this helps

Edited by mantapaperman, 25 October 2011 - 04:44 PM.

[Manta again]

Ok thanks that will give something to do at the weekend. If I get that far. Any other suggestions out there. Is there a fuel filter is it down by the tank, not seen one in the engine bay.

Edited by Manta again, 25 October 2011 - 04:57 PM.

[spiney_norman]

Don't think the carbed Mantas had an inline fuel filter as standard. Does sound like a blocked pipe issue though, so as mantapaperman said I'd recommend sticking a filter in there somewhere and blowing the lines through.

[monzta]

There are no filters in the back, just plain fuel line.

I would take a look at the ignition. Initially it would sound like the fuel shut off valve in the carb is stuck . This should also be controlled. Take the top part of the carb off (it is easy to remove the 5-6 screws with a plain screwdriver) and see if there is gasoline with the floater. If not, take a look at the underside of the top carb part. There should be a small valve there activated by the floater to let gasoline into the carb when fuel level in the floatchamber gets low, and often this can get stuck in shut position.

If this is not the issue, i would take a look at the ignition. Is there any spark ? How good is the spark ? Distributer and cap are not expensive parts, so change them, you can also test the coil (use another one from another car or something and see if this changes anything). Last but not least take a good look at the plugs. Are they wet with gasoline after an attempted startup there is propably not any spark.

Actually it is very easy to determin the problem you have. If the carb works (wet plugs) your problem is no spark or bad spark.

[gsi marc]

if its a mechanical fuel pump driven by the camshaft could the lobe for the pump be worn ?

[mantasrme]

Can you get the engine to splutter when its stationary by just revving it lots?
If so take the feed pipe from the pump and stick it in a can of fuel and check to see if it still splutters
No splutters mean its a problem with the pipe from the tank to engine bay, or possibly the pickup pipe in the tank.

However if it still splutters then the problem is still at the front end.
I have a vauge memory of one car i had that had fuel supply issues and someone had fitted 2 spacers behind the fuel pump so the plunger wasn't moving enough.

The standard pipe from tank to engine bay is a moulded plastic item that isn't the best.
It can get crimped and caught by things restricting the flow of fuel, also a tiny hole in the pipe won't necassarily leak fuel but will suck air when the fuel flows past.

[mantasrme]

monzta, on 25 October 2011 - 08:09 PM, said:

I would take a look at the ignition. Initially it would sound like the fuel shut off valve in the carb is stuck . This should also be controlled. Take the top part of the carb off (it is easy to remove the 5-6 screws with a plain screwdriver) and see if there is gasoline with the floater. If not, take a look at the underside of the top carb part. There should be a small valve there activated by the floater to let gasoline into the carb when fuel level in the floatchamber gets low, and often this can get stuck in shut position.

Actually it is very easy to determin the problem you have. If the carb works (wet plugs) your problem is no spark or bad spark.

While the original Varijet carb would have a solenoid valve the weber he's just fitted won't have so can't be that.
Also chances of having 2 different carbs with the same float problem are very small so more likely the problem is elsewhere.

When i helped start the car at Billing there was a good spark just no fuel at the carb, hence the addition of fuel direct down the carb and she fired straight up.

[Julian]

mantasrme, on 25 October 2011 - 08:17 PM, said:

Can you get the engine to splutter when its stationary by just revving it lots?
If so take the feed pipe from the pump and stick it in a can of fuel and check to see if it still splutters
No splutters mean its a problem with the pipe from the tank to engine bay, or possibly the pickup pipe in the tank.

However if it still splutters then the problem is still at the front end.
I have a vauge memory of one car i had that had fuel supply issues and someone had fitted 2 spacers behind the fuel pump so the plunger wasn't moving enough.

The standard pipe from tank to engine bay is a moulded plastic item that isn't the best.
It can get crimped and caught by things restricting the flow of fuel, also a tiny hole in the pipe won't necassarily leak fuel but will suck air when the fuel flows past.

Have you checked that the fuel tank is venting? like try it with the filler cap off.

Edited by Julian, 25 October 2011 - 08:35 PM.

[Manta again]

Thank you gentlemen for your input, now have a number of options to follow up. Just hope I can get it resolved otherwise the car will be up for sale.

[dog321fish]

When you do get the engine running trickle some redex through the carb while someone else revs the engine to keep it running, this should help clean the carb itself.

If you still have a problem after that, as has been said look at the ignition system. I had to replace a wire to the coil because of an intermittent starting/running fault.

Best of luck

Dave

[dynamytedan]

Manta again, on 25 October 2011 - 09:26 PM, said:

Thank you gentlemen for your input, now have a number of options to follow up. Just hope I can get it resolved otherwise the car will be up for sale.

perhaps its time to call it a day        , whats the price? , im not too far away and i fancy another 1800 for the GF .... its not a red one is it?

[monzta]

Fuel pump then?? they can act weird when worn, not the most expensive part either.

[mantasrme]

monzta, on 26 October 2011 - 09:53 PM, said:

Fuel pump then?? they can act weird when worn, not the most expensive part either.

Manta again, on 25 October 2011 - 04:14 PM, said:

A month ago i fitted a new fuel pump in an effort to resolve some of the issues, no change.

He's already tried that, and while a new pump could be faulty its very unlikely to produce exactly the same problems as the old one did.

[mantadoc]

I'm on fuel pump or carb...................


.......unless the coil or leads are breaking down when hot and the time it takes to get some fuel to pour is enough for it to cool.


Some of the connections on the ignition amp can be troublesome, especially the green piggy back that works the rev counter.

[Manta again]

Ok after having to recover my wife and family in the car on tuesday I decided to return the car back to its orignal configuration ie Varijet carb before I go through some of the suggestions all ready provided by you great manta folk. When the car was running with the weber on my wife said it was idling at about 2000rpm. didn't think anything of it at the time because I knew I would change it back to varijet. Guess what the car still idles at 2000rpm with the varijet on . Maybe instead of pouringg fuel down the carb I'm going to pour it over the car and use it on bonfire night!!!!!   Just hope I can sort her out.

[monzta]

The varajet is a absolute nightmare to sort. But if it is iddling that high there are 2 options. Either the automatic choke (cold start valve wont release), or the carb is drawing false air. Check your gaskets, vaacum hoses etc. Make sure there are no airleaks at all. Water is a excellent way to test this with, just douse the carb and manifold (not into the carb) with water while the engine is running, and listen if the iddle rises when you splash water on it.

But i would suggest that you use the Weber, it is better in every aspect. The varajet carb you can poor gasoline on and wee on the ashes and nobody will cry over that

If you have iddle problems (2000 rpm) with both carbs i am almost 100 % sure that you have an airleak somewhere.. Or some sort of ignition problem..

[Manta again]

Ok just spent the last hour under the bonnet. The reason for fast idle with the varijet was that i forgot to connect the earthing strap   therefore the electronic choke didn't work, idles great now with earth strap on . The fast idle for the weber must be down to its settings even though it came off my car!!

I installed a clear in line filter between the pump and carb and ran the engine with both old and new pumps fitted. The petrol is as clear as water!!! The rate of fuel delivery doesn't seem to be great certainly never enough to even part fill the small filter and is also inconsistent with both both pumps regardless of engine speed. If the lobe on the cam was worn I'd expect to see no difference in fuel volume. I also ran the car with fuel filler removed it made no difference to fuel delivery thereby eliminating a blocked vent issue

So all in all either the tank is full of crap but its not coming down the fuel line or the fuel line is partially blocked. Its just wiered that if you drive the car every day its OK 90% of the time.

Should I blow the fuel lines back through into the tank or remove them and do it, actually I will probably go and get new lines tomorrow. anyone got a spare hatch tank for me to try?????

Another more radical solution is bin the entire engine and go C20xe as some one said it could easily be done in a day with an 1800 car?? Anyone got a complete running setup from a manta and could guarentee my wife it could be done in a day

Edited by Manta again, 27 October 2011 - 04:06 PM.

[dog321fish]

How good or otherwise is the wiring to the coil?

On my Manta these wires age hardened and went brittle breaking down when hot. Just cut back to "good" wire and run a new length in.

Another suggestion is the ignition module available on eBay: http://www.ebay.co.u...=item587e730660

You will get there in the end.

Edited by dog321fish, 31 October 2011 - 03:33 PM.

[Manta again]

dog321fish, on 27 October 2011 - 04:20 PM, said:

How good or otherwise is the wiring to the coil?

On my Manta these wires age hardened and went brittle breaking down when hot. Just cut back to "good" wire and run a new length in.

Another suggestion is the ignition module available on eBay: http://www.ebay.co.u...=item484281d3d3

You will get there in the end.

Not sure its an electrical problem as the car always starts if you pour fuel into the carb, but will check the wiring tomorrow. thanks for the thought.